Date: Fri, 12 Jun 2020 21:05:02 +0200 From: Luca Barbato <lu_zero@...too.org> To: musl@...ts.openwall.com Subject: Re: Advocating musl to in windows subsystem and OS X On 12/06/2020 19:37, Rich Felker wrote: > On Fri, Jun 12, 2020 at 06:56:28PM +0200, Brian Peregrine wrote: >> Hey all, >> >> after thinking about my previous post (Advocating musl to the chromium >> OS developers ), it struck me that both Microsoft and Apple use some >> sort of libc too (Microsoft has the "subsystem for linux" on windows >> 10 now, and Apple's OS X is based on linux too -I think it was based >> on the "Darwin" linux distro. > > No, OSX is in some sense a BSD fork, but with major architectural > changes, and has nothing to do with Linux. Their libc is a BSD one > (FreeBSD I think) with tons of gratuitous changes made that did little > but intentionally break things, basically for NIH purposes/justifying > the existence of the project. (This is much like Google's Fuchsia fork > of musl.) > > musl does not run on OSX and while all of the pure-library code and > stdio code could in principle be used, actually making "musl for OSX" > would be a large project that doesn't make sense. What would make much > more sense is either reusing code or making corresponding improvements > based on things that are better in musl. > >> Microsoft probably uses glibc (as the subsystem seems to be >> canonical-made and they use glibc in ubuntu), for os x, I'm not sure >> what is being used. >> See https://itsfoss.com/install-bash-on-windows/ >> https://www.makeuseof.com/tag/microsoft-linux-distros-windows-10/ >> https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3601092 >> >> In either case, Rich, perhaps you can propose to both that they use >> musl, > > In some sense WSL doesn't "use" any libc; it's a thin syscall > emulation layer (WSL1) or near-full-linux-vm (WSL2) that's supposed to > be able to run any Linux userspace. My understanding is that they ship > some glibc-based distro, and I don't see that being viable for them to > change because they're supporting whatever users have built on it, but > anyone's free to use whatever they prefer. > > On a higher level, I don't really want anyone shipping musl in places > where the end user who receives it doesn't intend to use musl, for > much the same reason that I don't like it when distros ship systemd to > folks who don't intend to use systemd. It leads to gratuitous > complaints from people who are unhappy that it's different from what > they expect, and keep asking for changes to make it more glibc-like. > I'd much rather seek out a user base that *wants* what's different > about musl rather than "puts up with" what's different about musl. https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/p/alpine-wsl/9p804crf0395#activetab=pivot:overviewtab This seems available. lu
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