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Date: Fri, 7 Jul 2017 01:52:25 +0200
From: Jens Gustedt <jens.gustedt@...ia.fr>
To: musl@...ts.openwall.com
Subject: Re: Documentation of memcpy and undefined behavior in memset

Hello,

On Thu, 6 Jul 2017 21:23:07 +0200 Szabolcs Nagy <nsz@...t70.net> wrote:

> * Jens Gustedt <jens.gustedt@...ia.fr> [2017-07-06 20:52:18 +0200]:
> > Now when it comes to changes for a new standard, people would
> > certainly be more open-minded. So if anybody thinks they want to
> > make a proposal for C2x, don't hesitate.  
> 
> i wonder if c2x design will be done more openly
> than usual wg14 practice.. otherwise there is no
> point comming up with proposals, they won't even
> look at it until some member presents the idea
> at a meeting.

WG14 practice is to be conservative for the sake of backwards
compatibility. If you bring in new ideas, you have to be very careful
to convince people of your point and that it fits well into the
existing. They (mostly) want to standardize common practice, so if
there are reference implementations for your ideas, the better.

If you don't have anybody at the meeting to defend an idea, it is just
hard to defend it. That is not different than in other
organizations. If you are working for a company/institution that can
afford this, convince them that you want to go to the meetings. This
is two weeks a year, with some travel cost, something like 5000 € /
year or so (without the work cost) should do. This is our industry, C
is an important part of it and I really don't understand why there are
not more companies sending their people. This is not a big
investment. (But they do send them to the C++ meetings instead, e.g,
perhaps because it's more fancy?)

If you can't afford to go to the meetings, speak to a member, try to
get feedback on your ideas. Co-author DRs or proposals, and see for
yourself how your ideas fit into the standard.

I think musl would be a perfect code base to try new things out that
are related to the C library. (Not meaning to integrate extension into
the distribution, but to build demonstrators.) But this is not enough,
a thorrow write up must follow, and you'd have to have some breath.


Jens

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